4:55 a.m.
This has been bugging me for a while but its very minor...
!NetSurf.!Run is always open whilst running NS. This means
my backup (to propagate new versions to another machine via
USB memory) complains.
I know the reason is the NS-specific font removal obey
commands for when NS exits. I just wondered if there might
be a better way of doing this that doesn't leave the file
open? I currently edit !Run every time I update NS.
--
Mike Hobbs
5:10 a.m.
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 09:55:34 +0100
Mike Hobbs <mike.hobbs(a)antplc.com> wrote:
This has been bugging me for a while but its very minor...
!NetSurf.!Run is always open whilst running NS. This means
my backup (to propagate new versions to another machine via
USB memory) complains.
Why not fix the backup tool to not complain? :)
B.
11:29 a.m.
Rob Kendrick wrote:
Why not fix the backup tool to not complain? :)
Because that means the file will probably never be backed up. Not so
much of an issue for an application's !Run, but bad news if it's user data.
A company I worked for many years ago found out this out the hard way
when their Exchange server crashed, the backup tool had been silently
ignoring the Exchange database file always being open, and hadn't
actually backed it up in 3 years. But that's why we laugh at Windows.
Cheers
---David
--
Email: druck(a)druck.org.uk
Phone: +44-(0)7974 108301
11:35 a.m.
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 16:29:56 +0100
"David J. Ruck" <druck(a)druck.org.uk> wrote:
A company I worked for many years ago found out this out the hard way
when their Exchange server crashed, the backup tool had been silently
ignoring the Exchange database file always being open, and hadn't
actually backed it up in 3 years. But that's why we laugh at Windows.
I can't think of any operating system that would allow the safe and
meaningful backup of data in this situation. This is why backup tools
that are worthwhile have modules for dealing with specific products
like databases and exchange; they do logical backups of the data
instead. There's no way of knowing of the data you've backed up is
consistent of meaningful without the Exchange being involved, for
example.
Also, I forget: does RISC OS not allow files to be opened read-only
multiple times?
B.
8:30 p.m.
In message <20100712163547.429c86a4(a)trite.i.flarn.net.i.flarn.net>
Rob Kendrick <rjek(a)netsurf-browser.org> wrote:
Also, I forget: does RISC OS not allow files to be opened read-only
multiple times?
In case you mean FileSwitch specifically, I don't think it imposes any
restrictions on opening multiple read and/or write streams on the
same file and doing IO on them.
It's down to each FS to decide what they want or can support.
John.
--
John Tytgat
joty(a)netsurf-browser.org
11:54 a.m.
On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 09:55:34 +0100
Mike Hobbs <mike.hobbs(a)antplc.com> wrote:
This has been bugging me for a while but its very minor...
!NetSurf.!Run is always open whilst running NS. This means
my backup (to propagate new versions to another machine via
USB memory) complains.
I know the reason is the NS-specific font removal obey
commands for when NS exits. I just wondered if there might
be a better way of doing this that doesn't leave the file
open? I currently edit !Run every time I update NS.
We could move this to the exit code within the binary itself to avoid
this.
Alternatively I think we could get rid of the FontRemove entirely and
just leave the font available after NetSurf exits.
James
12:10 p.m.
On 12 Jul 2010, Mike Hobbs <mike.hobbs(a)antplc.com> wrote:
This has been bugging me for a while but its very minor...
!NetSurf.!Run is always open whilst running NS. This means my backup
(to propagate new versions to another machine via USB memory)
complains.
Maybe I misunderstand the problem, but why not quit NetSurf before you
try to backup?
Tony
5:21 a.m.
In message <62c4bd3551.old_coaster(a)old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk> Tony Moore
wrote:
On 12 Jul 2010, Mike Hobbs <mike.hobbs(a)antplc.com> wrote:
> This has been bugging me for a while but its very minor...
>
> !NetSurf.!Run is always open whilst running NS. This means my backup
> (to propagate new versions to another machine via USB memory)
> complains.
Maybe I misunderstand the problem, but why not quit NetSurf before
you
try to backup?
To answer this and other comments and suggestions:
1 The 'backup' tool I use is DirSync and its extremely useful
but it doesn't seem to be able to copy files that are open
(even though RISC OS does allow multiple opens for read)
2 I don't have the luxury of changing the way DirSync works
and the author has stopped maintaining it. Although I
offered to continue to to maintain it, that suggestion fell
on deaf ears.
3 I could close NetSurf before syncing directories but that is
little different from having to dismiss an error box - it
needs manual intervention. NS is running almost 24x7 too.
4 I can (and do) edit the !Run file to allow it to close after
NS starts but its a nuisance when updating NS regularly.
5 Integrity of the backup is not an issue because its just a
NS file that cab be easily recovered from elsewhere, but,
whilst DirSync can ignore directories it can't be told to
ignore files. See 2 above.
6 The suggestion to get the NS binary to remove the fonts on
exit would be most convenient, or simply don't bother to
remove them at all. This is what I'd like implemented.
--
Mike Hobbs
5:44 a.m.
Quoting Mike Hobbs <mike.hobbs(a)antplc.com>:
In message <62c4bd3551.old_coaster(a)old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore
wrote:
> On 12 Jul 2010, Mike Hobbs <mike.hobbs(a)antplc.com> wrote:
>> This has been bugging me for a while but its very minor...
>>
>> !NetSurf.!Run is always open whilst running NS. This means my backup
>> (to propagate new versions to another machine via USB memory)
>> complains.
> Maybe I misunderstand the problem, but why not quit NetSurf before you
> try to backup?
To answer this and other comments and suggestions:
1 The 'backup' tool I use is DirSync and its extremely useful
but it doesn't seem to be able to copy files that are open
(even though RISC OS does allow multiple opens for read)
2 I don't have the luxury of changing the way DirSync works
and the author has stopped maintaining it. Although I
offered to continue to to maintain it, that suggestion fell
on deaf ears.
3 I could close NetSurf before syncing directories but that is
little different from having to dismiss an error box - it
needs manual intervention. NS is running almost 24x7 too.
4 I can (and do) edit the !Run file to allow it to close after
NS starts but its a nuisance when updating NS regularly.
5 Integrity of the backup is not an issue because its just a
NS file that cab be easily recovered from elsewhere, but,
whilst DirSync can ignore directories it can't be told to
ignore files. See 2 above.
6 The suggestion to get the NS binary to remove the fonts on
exit would be most convenient, or simply don't bother to
remove them at all. This is what I'd like implemented.
Do you /have/ to have NS running 24/7?
One option may be to have a backup script, which closes NS (and
anything else that may be necessary) before running DirSync. I
did a similar thing a couple of years or so ago, though using a
Copy rather than DirSync. I needed to close down Messenger too.
You could even get the script to run NS up again afterwards.
Dave
7:07 a.m.
On 13/07/2010 10:21, Mike Hobbs wrote:
In message<62c4bd3551.old_coaster(a)old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore
wrote:
6 The suggestion to get the NS binary to remove the fonts on
exit would be most convenient, or simply don't bother to
remove them at all. This is what I'd like implemented.
That is dangerous, as it leaves invalid locations on the font path
should NetSurf be moved or deleted.
Of course a better solution would be not to store fonts inside an
application directory, but supply them in a !Fonts to be merged at
install time.
--
David J. Ruck
email: druck(a)druck.org.uk
phone: +44(0)7974 108301
7:11 a.m.
On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 12:07:53 +0100
"David J. Ruck" <druck(a)druck.org.uk> wrote:
Of course a better solution would be not to store fonts inside an
application directory, but supply them in a !Fonts to be merged at
install time.
But this complicates the installation procedure (which appears to be
complicated enough given how much difficulty people have), and leaves
an otherwise useless font loaded, bloating font selection menus, even
when NetSurf is not running.
B.
4705
days inactive
4706
days old
netsurf-users@netsurf-browser.org
11 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
dave higton -
David J. Ruck -
James Bursa -
John Tytgat -
John Williams -
Mike Hobbs -
Rob Kendrick -
Tony Moore